WHY JUST SOME?
|| By FITSNEWS || The United States military is closing an estimated fifteen bases in Europe – saving roughly half a billion dollars annually, the U.S. Department of Defense (DOD) announced this week.
Of course “saving” is a pretty curious term considering the latest U.S. budget deal included billions in new “emergency spending” for America’s ongoing “War on Terror” – money over and above the $521 billion the Pentagon is already receiving.
In other words any money “saved” by this reduction in force was long ago spent someplace else … probably on nonsense like this.
Anyway … the European military cuts won’t impact America’s 60,000-strong continental ground force, which is mostly stationed in England, Germany and Italy. But it will impact European jobs …
“I know that this will result in a reduction of our local host nations workforces at some locations,” outgoing U.S. secretary of defense Chuck Hagel said. “I value the tremendous support they provided us for decades.”
Wait … the support they provided us?
Okay … that’s an interesting way of looking at it.
Frankly, there’s no reason a single U.S. solider, tank, plane or ship should be stationed in or around Europe. Why not? Because defending Europe isn’t America’s job – and even if it was, we couldn’t afford it.
We’re broke, people!
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52 comments
Bases secured by American blood…given away by the same Administration that allows illegals with outstanding criminal convictions to roam our streets and commit acts of violence against innocent, law abiding legal citizens…
Excellent points. I agree with the Colonel about our strategic interests and the bases-NOT FITS.
What confuses this subject is Obama is the FIRST pResident we have ever elected that doesn’t have the best interests of this country in his heart and soul.
When you have a pResident that is anti-American in his policy , it makes a citizen want to withdraw from the world stage to protect our military.
Agree with you on illegals.
GWB closed Wurzburg based and removed the 1st Inf. Division out of Europe back to the US – is he a traitor too? (BTW – GWB also supports giving illegals drivers licenses – “family values don’t stop at the Rio Grande”
Iman Obama has to be proud! Barbara Boxer even quit on him. She knows the pubs will control the senate for at least a decade and the house for a generation!
“…Frankly, there’s no reason a single U.S. solider, tank, plane or ship should be stationed in or around Europe. Why not? Because defending Europe isn’t America’s job – and even if it was, we couldn’t afford it…”
Yeah and it’s always cheaper to land the forces on an opposed beach under fire…
As
far as Saddam Hussein being a great military strategist, he is neither a
strategist, nor is he schooled in the operational arts, nor is he a
tactician, nor is he a general, nor is he a soldier. Other than that,
he’s a great military man, I want you to know that. ~Norman Schwarzkopf
Fits for FITS too and you can add a couple of high ranking U.S. Government officials also.
Just when I am ready to give up on you…ya post something that allows me to believe you are truly a GREAT American and patriot.
Thanks for the insight.
The Colonel is right on it…..
Overseas posts and assignments are an opportunity for service personnel to learn about other countries and culture. The only country where my Dad was posted and could take the family was Germany and I loved it there.
I did a tour on a Greek island and have fond memories of being atop a mountain castle many times with lovely girls from different nations, and looking down at the beautiful, sunny Mediterranean and thinking, “I’m getting paid for this!”
Must have been Souda Bay. Crete is F**king nice.
Last and first chance for a beer after going over/coming back from the “Big Sandy”!!!!
(Unless you are lucky enough to be somewhere with a “ration card” like Quatar – that is!!!!)
We haven’t been “defending” anything in years, we are simply occupying our forward staging bases.
TBG and Will’s boy Paul understand this as well; what we have is an honest disagreement with you as to whether or not it is a good thing.
I don’t think they get it at all. I know poor ol’ Ravenel surely didn’t.
Tonto,
Having forward bases actually saves money – we evac’d Soldiers to Landsthul for medical treatment rather than flying them all the way home. We use the war stocks in Germany and other places to avoid 4,000 of the 7,800 mile trip that flying it in from the Continental US (CONUS) would cost. we flew dollars on charter aircraft to Ramstein, then loaded them onto USAF aircraft to save the hours on air force airframes. We perform maintenance on aircraft at Ramstein rather than flying it all the way home, those flight hours and fuel cost add up quickly. We did the same kinds of things in a place called Manas in Kyrgyzstan but we had to rent it at a cost of $60,000,000 and the Russians were able to convince the Kyrgies to kick us out (they raised the rent to $120,00,000).
OCONUS bases are essential to power projection – look at the Argentine / UK battle over the Falklands and you’ll see just how big a deal it can be. Reagan’s attack on Gaddafi was launched from the UK at the time we lacked a realistic option to attack from CONUS.
Forward bases are key to success – if you plan to go Woodrow Wilson or America First you can close them all down but we see how that worked out.
…if you plan to go Woodrow Wilson …
Rein it in, Hoss!!! Them’s fightin’ words!
…you can close them all down but we see how that worked out.
Worked out better for the USA than anywhere else on the planet. If your boy Woodrow Wilson hadn’t involved us in WWI (You know, “to make the world safe for Democracy (like Iraq, in our time), enable self determination (Muslim Brotherhood, anyone?) etc.)…there may have never been a WWII. TBG looks at WWI and WWII as essentially the same war with a 20 year truce in the middle.
You make pragmatic, as opposed to emotional [“They’re over there protecting YOUR freedoms, slacker!”] arguments, and TBG appreciates that.
There is, however, pragmatism in the US staying out of European and Mideastern wars–which have been going on , well, forever… as well as avoiding “ground wars in Asia”. Seems like the ability to do this is one of the bases upon which “American Exceptionalism” rests.
Just an idea, but Colonel – do we need the actual facilitiies, or just access to the facilities by the Europeans. Seriously, at this point the US military and NATO are about as integrated as they can be. For example, we used older US bases since given to NATO for attacks on Lybia (thinking Crete). I can see the military hospital in Wiesbaden, but for example, Wurzburg is now a NATO base, that we have folks assigned to as part of the integrated command structure.
Hard to tell me I can’t use the base when I’m occupying it. ..
Germany has never prevented us from using a base – though the French did kick us out of our Air Force bases in the 60s. But still, given the cooperation today between NATO and the US – why not let NATO have them. We still use the NATO bases in Luxembourg, the staging sites between Arlon and Luxembourg City, and most of the bases they’re talking about, my guess, are those farflung darlings in Central Germany where we had the radar sites. A 10-acre site in Heidelburg doesn’t excite me anymore.
Cooperation is great as long as we cooperate. ..
Good. Heidelberg is closed and turned over. Radar site? Wrong war.
Obama is going to give everyone 2 FREE years of college!!!!
We can turn those facilities into radical islam/socialist training camps for American students.
Or we could send them to your house and you can teach them to hate black people.
Thanks to the Lottery, Red SC already does that, ya know?
Computer spread sheets! Ain’t they grand …. Good fur threat assessment, too.
I’ll bet you spend more time in front of those TV typewriters than in the wind.
The Colonel must think he’s smarter than the folks at the Pentagon.
Do you understand how the Pentagon works?
He wasn’t arguing about the base closings (they’re not closing all of them); he was discrediting the moronic and sophomoric FITS position that not a *single* American soldier (he said “solider” actually) or piece of military hardware should be in Europe. I don’t think anyone really believes we can’t scale back just a little bit now that the world has shifted to low-grade conflict, insurgency, terrorism, etc. versus the Cold War model. Technology helps, too. Drones don’t require nearly the care and feeding that a brigade of ground troops or a squadron or two of USAF jets. All that being said, being “smarter than the Pentagon” is a pretty low bar. Their screwups are the stuff of legend.
I do think I’m smarter than a lot of folks at the Pentagon (I’ve temped there) but as you so eloquently pointed out, that’s a pretty low bar…
The issue (as you obviously know first-hand) is that the “Pentagon” represents more than a giant office complex full of soldiers. It’s the political issues, procurement/fiscal realities, pork, interference (not oversight) from politicians, etc. There are lots of smart folks there. Lots of stupid, self-serving jackasses, too.
“Lots of stupid, self-serving jackasses, too.”
Yep, sounds about right…especially in light of its proximity to Capitol Hill and the White House
BINGO!
Obama is smarter than all of us.Look how he turned the Radical Islamists into a superpower all over the world.Once he releases the most dangerous terrorists from Gitmo and closes it the world should be on fire.
I don’t think he is smarter than the folks at the Pentagon, I KNOW he is.
Sir, please. Don’t disrupt FITS’ dystopian reality that has the US as the evil warmongers stomping around Europe imposing our will on folks and killing Muslims. Reading this tripe tonight gave me an uncomfortable Ravenel flashback! Remember his piece on the “hundreds” of US bases in Germany? Not a single member of his extended entourage and camp knew that sounded a *little* off. I get their lack of military service and all of that and I get that they probably don’t pal around with many soldiers or vets because of their fringy views, but smart political people know to have consultants in areas wherein their knowledge is weak. I couldn’t do it, but I bet they could hire some old vet to pop up once in a while and say things like, “Uh, dude…most of these bases actually benefit American interests more than those of the host nation.”
Thank you for sharing this ‘link’.
” Remember his piece on the “hundreds” of US bases in Germany? Not a single member of his extended entourage and camp knew that sounded a *little* off. ”
Do you think it sounded a little off to his voters?
Ha! Excellent point…it obviously did. That actually gave me some sliver of hope for SC’s voting populace.
Thanks Colonel. On time on target. Especially the…
“Stick to politics Will, every time you post something like this you look as dumb as your boy Paul.”
‘Cept I will add economics to politics.
4/187
Ah, the mighty thunderchickens! I’ll agree Will gets other stuff right but he gets this stuff wrong 90% of the time.
Air Assault Sir! Rakkasan Raider
What a nauseating circle jerk. How about you two get a room?
Your momma was busy…
All of what you say was true, during the cold war. The fact is that our commitments have changed. We had an agreement (NATO) that said we would protect these nations when and if the USSR and affiliates attacked. In the 50s, 60s and 70s forward positioning troops was the only way to do that, those troops would now be fodder if attacked just the same as troops landing on an opposed beach.
NATO is a shell of what it was, and the United States should not be carrying the defense needs of Europe. Frankly, I am tired of maintaining European safety, and working longer hours to pay taxes, while the Germans take three months of vacation per year.
Removing troops from Europe is part of the dividend we should collect from Ronald Reagan’s term in office.
It’s even more true now. Can you imagine trying to deal with a contingency in Africa without a forward base in Europe?
I see your point about African intervention. However, what is our compelling interest there? What would be the contingency in Africa that would force our intervention?
From the way you speak I gather that your view is from much higher in the ranks than mine, so I question with all due respect.
I’m pretty rank alright, been cleaning up the back yard (or as my wife calls it, the family dump)…
Compelling interest in Africa, that’s a good question. The need to secure some WMDs to keep them out of the hands of a nut job might be one. (South Africa could put together a nuke fairly quickly, they’ve already done so in the 60s-70s) A humanitarian crisis on the magnitude of the current Ebola epidemic might be another.
Yeah, but Putin’s is a crazy Sonny Corleone in charge of a country and that requires some accommodation.
Plus, NATO made a monumental error in judgment by allowing Turkey in and that means there is a threat there radiating into Europe and the Middle East.
“Yeah and it’s always cheaper to land the forces on an opposed beach under fire”
We can’t save the world, & there’s a good chance that the accrued cost over time would actually equal any need to go back if the peace were kept for decades. (and we can’t know either way about lasting peace in that region)
I’m reminded of how a Cheetah routinely feeds herself over her cubs…because if she doesn’t the cubs die anyway even if they are starving.
If the US goes bankrupt(it already is, so instead let’s say we have a currency “problem”), then the troops come out anyway and we’ve impoverished our whole nation for the “good” of other countries and their citizens.
It’s simply not fair to taxpayers here.
If anything demonstrates how rigid (Libertarian in this case) adherence to ideology messes up you mind almost as much as religion, this post is it.
An alternate good/bad/O’Bummer scenario:
Park any EU based A-10s in Q8 & Jordan … In anticipation of the Lebanon/Syrian/Israel frontier lighting up. (Drudge headline this PM: Those dead Hezbulabula and Iranian generals were/are planning a big push into northern Israel???? )
my step-aunt makes $65 /hour on the internet . She has been without work for 10 months but last month her income was $12065 just working on the internet for a few hours. visit here;.insight.
my aunt makes $66 /hour on the laptop . She has been fired for eight months but last month her pay check was $16866 just working on the laptop for a few hours. use this link;.something that…
…and your mom makes six bucks a week doing lap dances for winos.
Nice background shot of a “J” model there…………………
Ah, the Mighty C-130 Hercules!!!!!!!
One of the best deals of military hardware “Uncle Sugar’ ever bought into!!!!!